Comments on: New Inscription and the Jewish Roots of Christianity: The “Aaargghh! Award” http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/2008/07/new-inscription-and-the-jewish-roots-of-christianity-the-aaargghh-award/ Your antidote to cyber-twaddle and misguided research about the ancient world. Thu, 09 Feb 2012 17:48:36 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v= By: Ilia Panayotov http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/2008/07/new-inscription-and-the-jewish-roots-of-christianity-the-aaargghh-award/comment-page-1/#comment-11194 Ilia Panayotov Mon, 18 Apr 2011 17:55:58 +0000 http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/?p=34#comment-11194 Well, some scholars think that this reading is not necessarily true. "The verb that Knohl translates as "rise!," Witherington says, could also mean "there arose," and so one can ask "does it mean 'he comes to life,' i.e., a resurrection, or that he just 'shows up?'" - time.com "I am inclined to read He instead of Het. That would indeed give us a reading of Ha>wt (‘the sign’), connecting line 80 with the previous line 79, and with the earlier line 17. Signs in the Vision of Gabriel are portentous and significant. In brief, the whole issue of this h>yh (with initial Het) suggested by Knohl is not only precarious, but also suspect. He had previously suggested a thesis regarding a resurrected Jewish mashiah, and has now found an opportunity with this letter Het (and Alef) to support his thesis. The other words that he supplies in line 80, with the exception of the existing ‘I Gabriel’ are in fact his own!" - victorsasson.blogspot.com Well, some scholars think that this reading is not necessarily true.

“The verb that Knohl translates as “rise!,” Witherington says, could also mean “there arose,” and so one can ask “does it mean ‘he comes to life,’ i.e., a resurrection, or that he just ‘shows up?’” – time.com

“I am inclined to read He instead of Het. That would indeed give us a reading of Ha>wt (‘the sign’), connecting line 80 with the previous line 79, and with the earlier line 17. Signs in the Vision of Gabriel are portentous and significant.
In brief, the whole issue of this h>yh (with initial Het) suggested by Knohl is not only precarious, but also suspect. He had previously suggested a thesis regarding a resurrected Jewish mashiah, and has now found an opportunity with this letter Het (and Alef) to support his thesis. The other words that he supplies in line 80, with the exception of the existing ‘I Gabriel’ are in fact his own!” – victorsasson.blogspot.com

]]> By: MSH http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/2008/07/new-inscription-and-the-jewish-roots-of-christianity-the-aaargghh-award/comment-page-1/#comment-11178 MSH Mon, 18 Apr 2011 15:46:34 +0000 http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/?p=34#comment-11178 I haven't seen anything to suggest it's the wrong reading; it's just sort of irrelevant (adding far too much importance to it). On the second question, the language is paralleled in ch 11, where the reference is to God, but I still think it could be either option. I haven’t seen anything to suggest it’s the wrong reading; it’s just sort of irrelevant (adding far too much importance to it). On the second question, the language is paralleled in ch 11, where the reference is to God, but I still think it could be either option.

]]> By: Ilia Panayotov http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/2008/07/new-inscription-and-the-jewish-roots-of-christianity-the-aaargghh-award/comment-page-1/#comment-11098 Ilia Panayotov Sun, 17 Apr 2011 10:13:17 +0000 http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/?p=34#comment-11098 So, Mike (Heiser), do you think Knohl's reading is correct or not? I mean that of the "In three days, live" line. And who do you think the Prince of the Host is in the Gabriel Vision? In Daniel, it's God (or the Second Power Who is still God) but what about here, in the Gabriel Vision? So, Mike (Heiser), do you think Knohl’s reading is correct or not? I mean that of the “In three days, live” line.

And who do you think the Prince of the Host is in the Gabriel Vision? In Daniel, it’s God (or the Second Power Who is still God) but what about here, in the Gabriel Vision?

]]> By: Anonymous http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/2008/07/new-inscription-and-the-jewish-roots-of-christianity-the-aaargghh-award/comment-page-1/#comment-11097 Anonymous Sun, 17 Apr 2011 10:12:44 +0000 http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/?p=34#comment-11097 So, Mike (Heiser), do you think Knohl's reading is correct or not? I mean that of the "In three days, live" line. And who do you think the Prince of the Host is in the Gabriel Vision? In Daniel, it's God (or the Second Power Who is still God) but what about here, in the Gabriel Vision? So, Mike (Heiser), do you think Knohl’s reading is correct or not? I mean that of the “In three days, live” line.

And who do you think the Prince of the Host is in the Gabriel Vision? In Daniel, it’s God (or the Second Power Who is still God) but what about here, in the Gabriel Vision?

]]> By: Michael http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/2008/07/new-inscription-and-the-jewish-roots-of-christianity-the-aaargghh-award/comment-page-1/#comment-2532 Michael Wed, 25 Aug 2010 01:12:25 +0000 http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/?p=34#comment-2532 Well, MSH, I've read over your posts again, and I'm satisfied my questions are answered. I think my reference to the Torah was a red herring/hearsay, so sorry for the confusion! Thanks. Well, MSH, I’ve read over your posts again, and I’m satisfied my questions are answered.
I think my reference to the Torah was a red herring/hearsay, so sorry for the confusion!
Thanks.

]]> By: MSH http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/2008/07/new-inscription-and-the-jewish-roots-of-christianity-the-aaargghh-award/comment-page-1/#comment-2516 MSH Mon, 23 Aug 2010 00:22:22 +0000 http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/?p=34#comment-2516 I still don't get the question. In the post I talk about the three day reference being in Hosea 6 (which is obviously in the Hebrew Scriptures) - ? http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/2009/11/more-media-paleobabble-on-the-gabriel-stone/ I still don’t get the question. In the post I talk about the three day reference being in Hosea 6 (which is obviously in the Hebrew Scriptures) – ?

http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/2009/11/more-media-paleobabble-on-the-gabriel-stone/

]]> By: MSH http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/2008/07/new-inscription-and-the-jewish-roots-of-christianity-the-aaargghh-award/comment-page-1/#comment-2515 MSH Mon, 23 Aug 2010 00:20:26 +0000 http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/?p=34#comment-2515 I've lost the context for this; it's been so long. The capitalized words are mine - but I don't remember the question. I’ve lost the context for this; it’s been so long. The capitalized words are mine – but I don’t remember the question.

]]> By: Michael http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/2008/07/new-inscription-and-the-jewish-roots-of-christianity-the-aaargghh-award/comment-page-1/#comment-2496 Michael Fri, 20 Aug 2010 10:58:05 +0000 http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/?p=34#comment-2496 In reply to your question ('where did Christ say his three day resurrection was in the Torah?'): '...he said to them, "So it is written that the Christ would suffer and on the third day rise from the dead' (S. Luke 24.46). I may well be wrong, but Christ seems to be saying that the third day resurrection was in 'the Law of Moses, in the Prophets and in the Psalms' (S. Luke 24.44). Thanks for taking the time to respond. I really appreciate it. In reply to your question (‘where did Christ say his three day resurrection was in the Torah?’):
‘…he said to them, “So it is written that the Christ would suffer and on the third day rise from the dead’ (S. Luke 24.46).
I may well be wrong, but Christ seems to be saying that the third day resurrection was in ‘the Law of Moses, in the Prophets and in the Psalms’ (S. Luke 24.44).
Thanks for taking the time to respond. I really appreciate it.

]]> By: Michael http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/2008/07/new-inscription-and-the-jewish-roots-of-christianity-the-aaargghh-award/comment-page-1/#comment-2495 Michael Fri, 20 Aug 2010 10:40:21 +0000 http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/?p=34#comment-2495 Dear MSH, Here is the paragraph you asked me to send you. I've capitalized the words I was asking about: "Mr. Boyarin: 'This should shake our basic view of Christianity, he said as he sat in his office of the Shalom Hartman Institute in Jerusalem where he is a senior fellow in addition to being the Yehezkel Kaufman Professor of Biblical Studies at Hebrew University. Resurrection after three days becomes a motif developed before Jesus, which runs contrary to nearly all scholarship. What happens in the New Testament was adopted by Jesus and his followers based on an earlier messiah story.' No, Mr. Knohl, this would FIT Christianity — it’s only a surprise given your assumption about Isaiah 53. The second part of this is correct — MOST CRITICAL SCHOLARS THINK THE “RESURRECTION AFTER THREE DAYS” WAS ADDED LATER. It’s not clear if Knohl agrees. At any rate, these scholars ASSUME that resurrection from the dead after three days isn’t found in the New Testament." Thank you. Dear MSH,

Here is the paragraph you asked me to send you. I’ve capitalized the words I was asking about:

“Mr. Boyarin: ‘This should shake our basic view of Christianity, he said as he sat in his office of the Shalom Hartman Institute in Jerusalem where he is a senior fellow in addition to being the Yehezkel Kaufman Professor of Biblical Studies at Hebrew University. Resurrection after three days becomes a motif developed before Jesus, which runs contrary to nearly all scholarship. What happens in the New Testament was adopted by Jesus and his followers based on an earlier messiah story.’

No, Mr. Knohl, this would FIT Christianity — it’s only a surprise given your assumption about Isaiah 53. The second part of this is correct — MOST CRITICAL SCHOLARS THINK THE “RESURRECTION AFTER THREE DAYS” WAS ADDED LATER. It’s not clear if Knohl agrees. At any rate, these scholars ASSUME that resurrection from the dead after three days isn’t found in the New Testament.”

Thank you.

]]> By: MSH http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/2008/07/new-inscription-and-the-jewish-roots-of-christianity-the-aaargghh-award/comment-page-1/#comment-2349 MSH Thu, 05 Aug 2010 16:35:27 +0000 http://michaelsheiser.com/PaleoBabble/?p=34#comment-2349 where did Christ say his three day resurrection was in the Torah? where did Christ say his three day resurrection was in the Torah?

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